Author Topic: Forge needs a rework  (Read 3422 times)

Hiero_Glyph

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Forge needs a rework
on: August 30, 2018, 03:06:05 AM
Increasing the level of your Forge should never hurt the player!

Build costs need to be fixed so that the player can build any weapon at Forge rank 0 for a nominal cost. Then if they want to upgrade that weapon the cost should increase to the next Forge level and continue until the weapon hits the maximum Forge level.

If you require the player to have a blueprint for each upgrade then you need to adjust how these drop. Think of it like a I, II, III, IV,... IX, X ugrade path. The player shouldn't have to wait to craft a new weapon, nor should they have to pay a huge amount just to try it and be penalized for it by wasting a blueprint before leveling the Forge.

Overall the Forge level system needs to be simplified/streamlined. It's confusing to new players and having the build cost increase as you level up your Forge makes it feel like you are being cheated, especially when upgrading requires a new blueprint.

But please don't make the player feel like leveling up the Forge is actually hurting them.

Hiero_Glyph

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Re: Forge needs a rework
Reply #1 on: September 02, 2018, 11:22:08 PM
So I wanted to detail how to improve the current forge because right now it punishes players for building weapons before upgrading the forge. Instead make it a weapon leveling system.

Each weapon starts at Forge 0 with no upgrades. The cost to build this weapon is minimal but it does require a blueprint. The next upgrade requires Forge level 1 and another blueprint but the cost is lower than the current system. This continues to the max Forge level, each time it requires a blueprint and costs some gold. No step can be skipped so the gold costs would have to be greatly reduced since every player is paying for every step from level 0 all the way up to the max Forge level.

In addition to this, blueprints can only be acquired once per Forge level. So if the Forge caps at level 20, that means you could only acquire a specific blueprint 21 times (once at rank 0, and 20x for each Forge level).  After that you would never get that blueprint on that character ever again. This provides enough grind, but doesn't punish players for not crafting/upgrading a weapon.

So let's say a new player loves Lycus. They play him for a while and eventually get Spinning Coin. They can craft it and try it out to compare it versus Dolores. Eventually the get Pepper Pot and they want to craft and try it too, except now it is level 0, while Spinning Coin is level 4. They keep playing and eventually get all of the possible blueprints for Dolores even though their Forge is not level 20 yet. This means that any future blue blueprints will be either Spinning Coin or Pepper Pot.

If that player eventually collects all 62 blue blueprints then any time they run Lycus and would get a blue blueprint, they instead get a chance for a 1.5x experience booster. That way treasure hunter works the same and they could fail just like with a blueprint.

This system would accomplish a few things. First the grind would be defined and players could work towards a weapon even if they got the other one since that is one less drop in that blueprint pool. Second, it would give players a better sense of progression as they would constantly be upgrading weapons as they acquired blueprints and their Forge level increased. Third, the cost of the upgrade would be more appropriate for new players since the cost would only increase each time a weapon was upgraded. So it would start out cheap and increase as the item leveled. This would also allow players to try out various weapons before deciding which one to invest in.

Anyway, I'm all for a long grind with some RNG, but eventually a player should max out a weapon and never have to get that blueprint again. It would be nice if players could track their progress and see how many Dolores blueprings they still need and know how many more times it could be upgraded though.

JestersShade

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Re: Forge needs a rework
Reply #2 on: September 05, 2018, 10:20:28 AM
Hi.

Your idea is interesting but it would force players to build a weapon 30 times to get it to max level which would cost a lot!

An idea I had for the forge would be to allow us to build at any level below or equal to our current one.
For example, I'm currently at forge level 5, so I would be able to build my weapons at a forge level 0, 1, 2, 3, 4 or 5.

This would allow me to test new weapons by building them at lvl 1 or 2 for instance, and if I like them (and get a new blueprint) I could build them at lvl 5.

I clearly agree with OP when saying that the current system hurts the player.
I've simply stopped building weapons because it costs too much for a weapon I don't even know (17k gold for a normal, 66K for a rare).

It's really a shame and I would love a system that encourages players to test weapons and to be happy when they get a blueprint or when their forge level increases; currently, I'm not happy when my forge level increases and I don't build weapon since forge lvl 3 so ...
« Last Edit: September 06, 2018, 09:35:27 AM by JestersShade »

Hiero_Glyph

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Re: Forge needs a rework
Reply #3 on: September 05, 2018, 05:20:10 PM
Hi.

Your idea is interesting but it would force players to build a weapon 30 times to get it to max level which would cost a lot!

An idea I had for the forge would be to allow us to build at any level below or equal to our current one.
For example, I'm currently at forge level 5, so I would be able to build my weapons at a forge level 0, 1, 2, 3, 4 or 5.

This would allow me to test new weapons by building them at lvl 1 or 2 for instance, and if I like them (and get a new blueprint) I could build them at lvl 5.

I clearly agree with OP when saying that the current system hurts the player.
I've simply stopped building weapong because it costs too much for a weapon I don't even know (17k gold for a normal, 66K for a rare).

It's really a shame and I would love a system that encourages players to test weapons and to be happy when they get a blueprint or when their forge level increases; currently, I'm not happy when my forge level increases and I don't build weapon since forge lvl 3 so ...

I'm aware that I am proposing a serious grind, but the gold cost would be severely reduced as a result. Also, the blueprint drop chances would also be changed so that they occur more frequently or could even be guaranteed on a victory. The goal is to give Mecurysteam a grindy progression path that also rewards the player every time they play, unlike now where you just get frustrated as you make no real progress for days/weeks.

Lancer

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Re: Forge needs a rework
Reply #4 on: October 16, 2018, 07:23:47 PM
Hi.

Your idea is interesting but it would force players to build a weapon 30 times to get it to max level which would cost a lot!

An idea I had for the forge would be to allow us to build at any level below or equal to our current one.
For example, I'm currently at forge level 5, so I would be able to build my weapons at a forge level 0, 1, 2, 3, 4 or 5.

This would allow me to test new weapons by building them at lvl 1 or 2 for instance, and if I like them (and get a new blueprint) I could build them at lvl 5.

I clearly agree with OP when saying that the current system hurts the player.
I've simply stopped building weapong because it costs too much for a weapon I don't even know (17k gold for a normal, 66K for a rare).

It's really a shame and I would love a system that encourages players to test weapons and to be happy when they get a blueprint or when their forge level increases; currently, I'm not happy when my forge level increases and I don't build weapon since forge lvl 3 so ...

I'm aware that I am proposing a serious grind, but the gold cost would be severely reduced as a result. Also, the blueprint drop chances would also be changed so that they occur more frequently or could even be guaranteed on a victory. The goal is to give Mecurysteam a grindy progression path that also rewards the player every time they play, unlike now where you just get frustrated as you make no real progress for days/weeks.
I agree with both of your ideas, and tbh i was thinking of a hybrid system of the two, say each upgrade doesn't necessarily need to be linear. You can't go past Your current forge level but say you wanted to test a weapon at lvl 3 it would cost 3 blueprints and the acuminative gold of the three upgrades but you cant downgrade and it would cost... 50000 gold at max to respect a gun you feel you made a mistake on how you built it, like building mikahs gun for anything other then crit

Lancer

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Re: Forge needs a rework
Reply #5 on: October 17, 2018, 10:05:13 PM
MS?

Angeles2099

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Re: Forge needs a rework
Reply #6 on: October 18, 2018, 06:10:22 AM
*Bump*
I completely agree with this post, also if the duplicates don't go towards a different gun than it should be transferred into gold.