Mercurysteam's Hangout
BARRACKS => Gameplay Feedback => Topic started by: Treycol1 on November 14, 2018, 07:49:20 PM
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i love this game, and i also love its developers, but i feel like the game should've kept offline/online system, the game has improved greatly, but some of us don't always have access to internet, some of us want to play solo offline, other than that, i want like to say that this game would be the goat if it had different modes, such as 4v4 death match
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I thought you were Karen for a moment there. I was like, "Karen, are you asking them here? Why don't you just ask the devs directly?" LOL
I completely agree, by the way, with all you are requesting.
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I thought it was too Drow. Lol
I was honestly surprised this didn't have an offline mode.
4v4 Death match though, if you thought the Antag rage was bad, that'll ignite a whole difference powder keg. I do think it would be fun.
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Mercurysteam making the game online only was one of the reasons I walked away from it a few months ago. I may be playing Raiders/Broken Planet again, but the move to online only was shady, and I wont spend another dollar on anything Mercurysteam touches again. Hopefully one day they make the game online/offline again.
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Hi everyone!
Our intention when we created this new system was being honest with the player. We want to first show him or her the nature of Spacelords. That means cooperate together using all your resources to complete a mission and defeating the Antagonist.
Once the player understands the mechanics, he/she can enjoy the training mode and practice to improve his/her stats. I know we have said this many times, but the core of Spacelords is the Antagonist feature and we would love for all the players to experience it, at least once.
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Hi everyone!
Our intention when we created this new system was being honest with the player. We want to first show him or her the nature of Spacelords. That means cooperate together using all your resources to complete a mission and defeating the Antagonist.
Once the player understands the mechanics, he/she can enjoy the training mode and practice to improve his/her stats. I know we have said this many times, but the core of Spacelords is the Antagonist feature and we would love for all the players to experience it, at least once.
You really expect players to stick around until they understand the mechanics to fully enjoy the game when it is nothing but infuriating with an antag invasion that leads to absolute hopelessness and then noobs in mentor matches who cant even dent an enemy due to their low level. Seriously?
Since i joined this game about a month back, almost every antagonist match the raider team was wiped out. When an antag joins its either solely focus on the antag to stand a chance or get annihilated trying to complete mission objective. That is not fun. I dont see where the developers are getting their data that the antag system is actually balanced. I find the game overwhelmingly favours antags and you dont even need to be good to defeat a team of raiders. Melee is so ridiculously overpowered to the point that my experience of antag matches is that most solely rely on that and it works. My experience has been nothing but negative anytime an antag joins. If anything you the developers will spout about how great your antag system is but if so why not add optional antag invasion with increased rewards?. Thats right you wont because barely anyone would actually opt for an antag invasion. Ive been in countless lame antag matches and mid-high level players completely give up just wanting the match to end by surrendering so they can play a PVE match with a team of raiders. I feel as if you guys are completely out of touch. The core gameplay is great but even that cant overcome the frustrations that i have with this game. Theres a reason a game with great gameplay like this is not doing as well as it could. Lastly you are driving away countless amount of beginners because you dont make the mentor matches easier. 75% of the time the noob quits midway cause the mobs are too difficult for them.
You have to realize that while you might make the excuse that if 4 raiders stick together they can overpower an antag and win that doesnt actually happen. Youve based the antag system on 4 raiders banding together to fight the antag with support of his AI companions and at times mission objectives with time limits that further complicate things and expect the team of 4 raiders to manage it? You forgot the most important problem. Players dont stick together and sure as hell dont work together consisting of a bunch of randoms. If friendly fire was on they would probably kill each other regularly.
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Hi everyone!
Our intention when we created this new system was being honest with the player. We want to first show him or her the nature of Spacelords. That means cooperate together using all your resources to complete a mission and defeating the Antagonist.
Once the player understands the mechanics, he/she can enjoy the training mode and practice to improve his/her stats. I know we have said this many times, but the core of Spacelords is the Antagonist feature and we would love for all the players to experience it, at least once.
You really expect players to stick around until they understand the mechanics to fully enjoy the game when it is nothing but infuriating with an antag invasion that leads to absolute hopelessness and then noobs in mentor matches who cant even dent an enemy due to their low level. Seriously?
Since i joined this game about a month back, almost every antagonist match the raider team was wiped out. When an antag joins its either solely focus on the antag to stand a chance or get annihilated trying to complete mission objective. That is not fun. I dont see where the developers are getting their data that the antag system is actually balanced. I find the game overwhelmingly favours antags and you dont even need to be good to defeat a team of raiders. Melee is so ridiculously overpowered to the point that my experience of antag matches is that most solely rely on that and it works. My experience has been nothing but negative anytime an antag joins. If anything you the developers will spout about how great your antag system is but if so why not add optional antag invasion with increased rewards?. Thats right you wont because barely anyone would actually opt for an antag invasion. Ive been in countless lame antag matches and mid-high level players completely give up just wanting the match to end by surrendering so they can play a PVE match with a team of raiders. I feel as if you guys are completely out of touch. The core gameplay is great but even that cant overcome the frustrations that i have with this game. Theres a reason a game with great gameplay like this is not doing as well as it could. Lastly you are driving away countless amount of beginners because you dont make the mentor matches easier. 75% of the time the noob quits midway cause the mobs are too difficult for them.
You have to realize that while you might make the excuse that if 4 raiders stick together they can overpower an antag and win that doesnt actually happen. Youve based the antag system on 4 raiders banding together to fight the antag with support of his AI companions and at times mission objectives with time limits that further complicate things and expect the team of 4 raiders to manage it? You forgot the most important problem. Players dont stick together and sure as hell dont work together consisting of a bunch of randoms. If friendly fire was on they would probably kill each other regularly.
Hey there, My name's is Hernan and I'm a technical game designer working on the game.
What Karen commented--putting new players into real co-op matches instead of single player matches--, is a decision we made taking into account data we've been gathering from players' matches over the last year.
Just like you, we believe players' first matches are really important, but one must not forget they should also work as an honest display of what the game's about, including its assymetric semi-competitive nature.
About the whole Antagonist issue, we will be releasing a new State of the Game soon. We'll be sharing some of the data we've been collecting, and explaining to you guys some of the whys and hows of the system. I hope that clears some of your concerns. :)
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Mercurysteam making the game online only was one of the reasons I walked away from it a few months ago. I may be playing Raiders/Broken Planet again, but the move to online only was shady, and I wont spend another dollar on anything Mercurysteam touches again. Hopefully one day they make the game online/offline again.
What..is shady about being online only? Some of the most popular games in the world are online only. Just off the top of my head; World of Warcraft, Fortnite Battle Royale, League of Legends, Defense of the Ancients, Spacelords, Counter Strike: Global Offensive and etc.
That stuff.
I stuck around. The point is that if people had the option to grind offline then it introduces massive balance issues, not to mention a more easy avenue through which to hack the game. How would rewards work for offline? Would you get the same amount of stuff as your online counterpart? Then the challenge would have to be similar and good luck soloing Short-Fused and scoring really well when you're the only thing the AI will focus.
But beyond that it is the intention of the developers to present their game at its fullest the very first time it is played. I'm sure there are many stories of impossible scenarios given to a group of Raiders, like they are all low level and they must contend with a high level Antagonist, and I have one too. Just less than 5 matches in I ran into a very high level Antagonist and I was absolutely shredded. I really had no idea what was going on and I appreciated the game's brutal nature. But here is the thing I had won my last few matches which only contained the AI. When I was first invaded my thought was "Dark Souls with guns" and I loved it. I still do.
There are many factors which are involved in this discussion. Especially since it is, like usual, becoming a thread about Antagonists. Which makes sense; the Antagonist feature is a very good one and without it this game would be less. So it is important for you to understand this thing.
Competitiveness breeds innovation. It makes things interesting. Once you have done the 17 missions 40-50 times each you start to wonder what other challenge there could be. I know that I instinctively know where things will spawn, how long it takes to do such and such action etc. But an Antagonist switches it all up.
It makes it fun. If it were playable offline and online then those people whom do not like Antagonists would play strictly offline. And, logically, I wonder what they are playing a game that has Antagonists for in the first place? There are many other games which do not have such systems of PvP.
So, I think it is more a matter of wanting to win at something without a challenge in place. Because Antagonists are a major part of the game and not liking them is almost tantamount to just not liking the whole game, can you truly say you like the gameplay if you hate 50% of it?
It is not wrong for the developers to choose how they want to present their game, it is their investment, their work, their game.
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Hi everyone!
Our intention when we created this new system was being honest with the player. We want to first show him or her the nature of Spacelords. That means cooperate together using all your resources to complete a mission and defeating the Antagonist.
Once the player understands the mechanics, he/she can enjoy the training mode and practice to improve his/her stats. I know we have said this many times, but the core of Spacelords is the Antagonist feature and we would love for all the players to experience it, at least once.
You really expect players to stick around until they understand the mechanics to fully enjoy the game when it is nothing but infuriating with an antag invasion that leads to absolute hopelessness and then noobs in mentor matches who cant even dent an enemy due to their low level. Seriously?
Since i joined this game about a month back, almost every antagonist match the raider team was wiped out. When an antag joins its either solely focus on the antag to stand a chance or get annihilated trying to complete mission objective. That is not fun. I dont see where the developers are getting their data that the antag system is actually balanced. I find the game overwhelmingly favours antags and you dont even need to be good to defeat a team of raiders. Melee is so ridiculously overpowered to the point that my experience of antag matches is that most solely rely on that and it works. My experience has been nothing but negative anytime an antag joins. If anything you the developers will spout about how great your antag system is but if so why not add optional antag invasion with increased rewards?. Thats right you wont because barely anyone would actually opt for an antag invasion. Ive been in countless lame antag matches and mid-high level players completely give up just wanting the match to end by surrendering so they can play a PVE match with a team of raiders. I feel as if you guys are completely out of touch. The core gameplay is great but even that cant overcome the frustrations that i have with this game. Theres a reason a game with great gameplay like this is not doing as well as it could. Lastly you are driving away countless amount of beginners because you dont make the mentor matches easier. 75% of the time the noob quits midway cause the mobs are too difficult for them.
You have to realize that while you might make the excuse that if 4 raiders stick together they can overpower an antag and win that doesnt actually happen. Youve based the antag system on 4 raiders banding together to fight the antag with support of his AI companions and at times mission objectives with time limits that further complicate things and expect the team of 4 raiders to manage it? You forgot the most important problem. Players dont stick together and sure as hell dont work together consisting of a bunch of randoms. If friendly fire was on they would probably kill each other regularly.
since the last patch mentor matches have become trivial for high level players, which is a good thing since they are perfect for new players, and even if they don't perform well they can be carried and wont be loosing their first game, the difficulty for new players thing is no more.
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"Mentor Matches", oh yeah the match where you get 20% more xp and a little more gold and faction when all the new players quit in the first section.
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"Mentor Matches", oh yeah the match where you get 20% more xp and a little more gold and faction when all the new players quit in the first section.
as i said, they are trivial now. that is a good thing in mentor matches and the game does warn you about the mentor thing so the devs arent at fault on that aspect.
i still think people who cant play online should be able to play solo but if say its impossible to win mentor matches you are wrong.
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"Mentor Matches", oh yeah the match where you get 20% more xp and a little more gold and faction when all the new players quit in the first section.
as i said, they are trivial now. that is a good thing in mentor matches and the game does warn you about the mentor thing so the devs arent at fault on that aspect.
i still think people who cant play online should be able to play solo but if say its impossible to win mentor matches you are wrong.
Some people just can't handle the extra difficulty from having a low level player in their game. It is these people who are the most critical of the mentor system.
I'm pretty sure this is like the only game I have ever played that gives me any sort of bonus for playing with new players. But people don't like to think and instead they want stuff. So if there is a reward on the table people's natural greed will make them want more even if they didn't really deserve it in the first place.
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Oy vey. I understand peoples frustrations with the Antagonist system it can be broken at times. But please tell me how is it other players have such a hard time dealing with an Antag and i dont? How is it my games are so different from theirs that they would call for the Antagonist system to be removed or made optional? But before you answer let me give you a little insight on how i play the game.
When i jump on Spacelords I check to see what Bps are available and which ones have very high gold and faction rewards. I play as a raider when try to obtain my daily rewards and when completed ill switch up and play as an Antag for a few games. I run in to my fair share antags. I win some i lose some, but i have a good time. I get that some of the player base doesnt like PVP but its not like they arent skilled players. So what reason could you give me other than "you dont like PVP" to get rid of the Antagonist system.
Further more Every person that dislikes both the Antgonist system and mentor matches only wishes to get rid of it by making it possible to opt out of both. Yet they never offer up any solutions to try and fix the current system. Half these problems could be solved with a solid form of communication between players. The prompt system doesnt work. If players (both vet and rookie) could communicate more clearly, coordinating against antags and teaching rookies would be so much easier.
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Oy vey. I understand peoples frustrations with the Antagonist system it can be broken at times. But please tell me how is it other players have such a hard time dealing with an Antag and i dont? How is it my games are so different from theirs that they would call for the Antagonist system to be removed or made optional? But before you answer let me give you a little insight on how i play the game.
When i jump on Spacelords I check to see what Bps are available and which ones have very high gold and faction rewards. I play as a raider when try to obtain my daily rewards and when completed ill switch up and play as an Antag for a few games. I run in to my fair share antags. I win some i lose some, but i have a good time. I get that some of the player base doesnt like PVP but its not like they arent skilled players. So what reason could you give me other than "you dont like PVP" to get rid of the Antagonist system.
Further more Every person that dislikes both the Antgonist system and mentor matches only wishes to get rid of it by making it possible to opt out of both. Yet they never offer up any solutions to try and fix the current system. Half these problems could be solved with a solid form of communication between players. The prompt system doesnt work. If players (both vet and rookie) could communicate more clearly, coordinating against antags and teaching rookies would be so much easier.
Right now we have raiders suiciding or surrendering relatively early when an antag invasion happens all because they want to team up with raiders to enjoy the pve content without an antagonist. The proposal to add optional antag invasion is so those that want a matchup like that can find others whom also want it. Why would you want the system to offer no option when it is clear lots of people dont like it. By not offering an option you force players to either surrender immediately or suicide so the game is over as fast as possible. If you like competition so much why are you against an optional mode? You do realize by offering an option of opting out means youll be matched with others who are very competitive like yourself? While the rest of the population enjoys the PVE content. Some here are so insistent about how great the antag system is but if thats the case and you believe many enjoy it then why are you not willing to add an opt out mode for only 4vsPVE. To me it seems pretty straightforward. I have unfortunately quit the game as its no longer for me. Maybe once upon a time when the population was healthy and the teams were balanced it worked but not anymore. Just because someone wants opt out pvp doesnt mean theyll never try the antag mode later down the line. Sometimes its best to offer alternatives instead of driving away players.
As for why you find it easy? It could be a multitude of reasons. Whats your level? If high why not start as a new player to understand the frustrations that we experience being vetted against high level antags. Its easy for the veterans to downplay everything we say because you lot are well equipped with insane passive skills, high forge weapons and faction cards that make you unstoppable.
This game cant survive on veterans alone. It needs new players to join but with the incredibly difficult mentor matches and the high lvl antag invasions it drives them away as helplessness sinks in watching yourself getting pummeled in a blink of an eye. Thats not challenging its GOD mode.
You want my suggestion for a fix? Okay here goes. Make it so that when a match is found with an antagonist invasion equalize both parties passive skills and gun damage so its more to do with skill. Example matchup which i had recently.
Raider 1: lvl 65
Raider 2: lvl 64
Raider 3: lvl 35
Raider 4: lvl 150
Antagonist: lvl 557
Before the game even passed the antagonist invasion screen the lvl 35 quit. So us 3 loaded into the game. We were pinned down from the moment it started. The combination of the AI and the antag made it absolutely futile. The level 150 began suiciding to end the game quickly. One other player joined in and that was it. On the other hand if the system took the combined numbers of both teams with attributes like passive skills and forge lvl weapons etc and equalized the playing field during the match im sure people would be more positive about it. Although now this game is simply a feeding ground for high level players whom think that anyone complaining doesnt like pvp.
Another example
Raider 1: Lvl 68
Raider 2: lvl 66
Raider 3: lvl 12
Raider 4: lvl 4
Antagonist lvl: 61
You may say this seems right but thats not actually the case. While the first 2 raiders have a more equal chance of defeating the antag obviously dependent on Ai ability due to MMR the 3rd and 4th players stand very little chance og going toe to toe. On the other hand if it artificially increased everyones level and forge lvl to equalize the field yet again the matchup would be more reliant on skill and every player would have a fighting chance. 2 lvl 60s against an antag lvl 60 may seem like its favouring the raiders but incorporate the number of ai mobs and time limited missions and suddenly the antag has the edge as the 3rd and 4th raider are too weak to even deal with mobs leaving the two lvl 60 raiders overwhelmed by mobs giving easy victories to the antag.
This also gives noobs a good fighting chance at pvp as the damage output is leveled across the playing field.
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I have unfortunately quit the game as its no longer for me.
Boy, you should have lead with that.
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I have unfortunately quit the game as its no longer for me.
Boy, you should have lead with that.
It doesnt mean my issues with the game are no longer valid. After all im not the only one mentioning it. Why do you think im on the forums conveying my frustration? I like the game but there are some serious balance issues.
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Hi everyone!
Our intention when we created this new system was being honest with the player. We want to first show him or her the nature of Spacelords. That means cooperate together using all your resources to complete a mission and defeating the Antagonist.
Once the player understands the mechanics, he/she can enjoy the training mode and practice to improve his/her stats. I know we have said this many times, but the core of Spacelords is the Antagonist feature and we would love for all the players to experience it, at least once.
You really expect players to stick around until they understand the mechanics to fully enjoy the game when it is nothing but infuriating with an antag invasion that leads to absolute hopelessness and then noobs in mentor matches who cant even dent an enemy due to their low level. Seriously?
Since i joined this game about a month back, almost every antagonist match the raider team was wiped out. When an antag joins its either solely focus on the antag to stand a chance or get annihilated trying to complete mission objective. That is not fun. I dont see where the developers are getting their data that the antag system is actually balanced. I find the game overwhelmingly favours antags and you dont even need to be good to defeat a team of raiders. Melee is so ridiculously overpowered to the point that my experience of antag matches is that most solely rely on that and it works. My experience has been nothing but negative anytime an antag joins. If anything you the developers will spout about how great your antag system is but if so why not add optional antag invasion with increased rewards?. Thats right you wont because barely anyone would actually opt for an antag invasion. Ive been in countless lame antag matches and mid-high level players completely give up just wanting the match to end by surrendering so they can play a PVE match with a team of raiders. I feel as if you guys are completely out of touch. The core gameplay is great but even that cant overcome the frustrations that i have with this game. Theres a reason a game with great gameplay like this is not doing as well as it could. Lastly you are driving away countless amount of beginners because you dont make the mentor matches easier. 75% of the time the noob quits midway cause the mobs are too difficult for them.
You have to realize that while you might make the excuse that if 4 raiders stick together they can overpower an antag and win that doesnt actually happen. Youve based the antag system on 4 raiders banding together to fight the antag with support of his AI companions and at times mission objectives with time limits that further complicate things and expect the team of 4 raiders to manage it? You forgot the most important problem. Players dont stick together and sure as hell dont work together consisting of a bunch of randoms. If friendly fire was on they would probably kill each other regularly.
Hey there, My name's is Hernan and I'm a technical game designer working on the game.
What Karen commented--putting new players into real co-op matches instead of single player matches--, is a decision we made taking into account data we've been gathering from players' matches over the last year.
Just like you, we believe players' first matches are really important, but one must not forget they should also work as an honest display of what the game's about, including its assymetric semi-competitive nature.
About the whole Antagonist issue, we will be releasing a new State of the Game soon. We'll be sharing some of the data we've been collecting, and explaining to you guys some of the whys and hows of the system. I hope that clears some of your concerns. :)
Hey Hernan. Want to start of by saying that you and your team made a great game. There are just some things that i feel hold the game back as ive explained. I will be eagerly awaiting news on the game.
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Oy vey. I understand peoples frustrations with the Antagonist system it can be broken at times. But please tell me how is it other players have such a hard time dealing with an Antag and i dont? How is it my games are so different from theirs that they would call for the Antagonist system to be removed or made optional? But before you answer let me give you a little insight on how i play the game.
When i jump on Spacelords I check to see what Bps are available and which ones have very high gold and faction rewards. I play as a raider when try to obtain my daily rewards and when completed ill switch up and play as an Antag for a few games. I run in to my fair share antags. I win some i lose some, but i have a good time. I get that some of the player base doesnt like PVP but its not like they arent skilled players. So what reason could you give me other than "you dont like PVP" to get rid of the Antagonist system.
Further more Every person that dislikes both the Antgonist system and mentor matches only wishes to get rid of it by making it possible to opt out of both. Yet they never offer up any solutions to try and fix the current system. Half these problems could be solved with a solid form of communication between players. The prompt system doesnt work. If players (both vet and rookie) could communicate more clearly, coordinating against antags and teaching rookies would be so much easier.
Snip
Only thing that's rough when you begin the game against antags is jack diddly for rewards and wasted time. That's what irked me back when I first started playing and what I feel for newer players today.
That being said, everyone is different. I love the gameplay so much, I didn't mind (most of the time) getting my ass kicked by antags. And it honestly made me a much better player. Not only helps being better against antags obviously, but also the PvE. It really sharpens your awareness and your ability to carry. As for as advantages/disadvantages in PvE, there are ALOT of variables that make that up, player level is just a small part of that. The game not being newbie friendly may not be good on MSE part to the sell the game, but it being a positive or negative is subjective. It's niche title anyway...
As for as folks quitting on sight when an antagonist shows up...don't know if it's a PC/XBox thing, but I play on PS4 and am level 168 and I have only seen that happen like 3 or 4 times through my playtime (and one of them is someone on this forum, who won't be named, but is a level 300+. You should be ashamed of yourself ::)). But your mileage may vary I guess...
I'm not opposed to antags being optional, but that would mean less games for antags. I don't play antag personally, but if I did, that pissed me off. Since I don't, I have no strong feelings, but the PvP folk would have every right to get mad ... My personal opinion is to just penalize players a portion of their rewards who opt out of antag. Tier 5 (LV 1-19) won't get penalized, but after that penalty will be steeper the farther the tier.
For now, like I suggest to every anti-antag person, find a group on reddit, discord, gamefaqs, etc who feel the same as you do and squad up. You'll queue matches much faster and you can all surrender when an antag shows up.
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Oy vey. I understand peoples frustrations with the Antagonist system it can be broken at times. But please tell me how is it other players have such a hard time dealing with an Antag and i dont? How is it my games are so different from theirs that they would call for the Antagonist system to be removed or made optional? But before you answer let me give you a little insight on how i play the game.
When i jump on Spacelords I check to see what Bps are available and which ones have very high gold and faction rewards. I play as a raider when try to obtain my daily rewards and when completed ill switch up and play as an Antag for a few games. I run in to my fair share antags. I win some i lose some, but i have a good time. I get that some of the player base doesnt like PVP but its not like they arent skilled players. So what reason could you give me other than "you dont like PVP" to get rid of the Antagonist system.
Further more Every person that dislikes both the Antgonist system and mentor matches only wishes to get rid of it by making it possible to opt out of both. Yet they never offer up any solutions to try and fix the current system. Half these problems could be solved with a solid form of communication between players. The prompt system doesnt work. If players (both vet and rookie) could communicate more clearly, coordinating against antags and teaching rookies would be so much easier.
Snip
Only thing that's rough when you begin the game against antags is jack diddly for rewards and wasted time. That's what irked me back when I first started playing and what I feel for newer players today.
That being said, everyone is different. I love the gameplay so much, I didn't mind (most of the time) getting my ass kicked by antags. And it honestly made me a much better player. Not only helps being better against antags obviously, but also the PvE. It really sharpens your awareness and your ability to carry. As for as advantages/disadvantages in PvE, there are ALOT of variables that make that up, player level is just a small part of that. The game not being newbie friendly may not be good on MSE part to the sell the game, but it being a positive or negative is subjective. It's niche title anyway...
As for as folks quitting on sight when an antagonist shows up...don't know if it's a PC/XBox thing, but I play on PS4 and am level 168 and I have only seen that happen like 3 or 4 times through my playtime (and one of them is someone on this forum, who won't be named, but is a level 300+. You should be ashamed of yourself ::)). But your mileage may vary I guess...
I'm not opposed to antags being optional, but that would mean less games for antags. I don't play antag personally, but if I did, that pissed me off. Since I don't, I have no strong feelings, but the PvP folk would have every right to get mad ... My personal opinion is to just penalize players a portion of their rewards who opt out of antag. Tier 5 (LV 1-19) won't get penalized, but after that penalty will be steeper the farther the tier.
For now, like I suggest to every anti-antag person, find a group on reddit, discord, gamefaqs, etc who feel the same as you do and squad up. You'll queue matches much faster and you can all surrender when an antag shows up.
PvP is just a one shot fest idk how anyone can enjoy that but whatever. And I was probably the lv 300 I don't really care about being exposed online tbh so feel free to do so.
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Oy vey. I understand peoples frustrations with the Antagonist system it can be broken at times. But please tell me how is it other players have such a hard time dealing with an Antag and i dont? How is it my games are so different from theirs that they would call for the Antagonist system to be removed or made optional? But before you answer let me give you a little insight on how i play the game.
When i jump on Spacelords I check to see what Bps are available and which ones have very high gold and faction rewards. I play as a raider when try to obtain my daily rewards and when completed ill switch up and play as an Antag for a few games. I run in to my fair share antags. I win some i lose some, but i have a good time. I get that some of the player base doesnt like PVP but its not like they arent skilled players. So what reason could you give me other than "you dont like PVP" to get rid of the Antagonist system.
Further more Every person that dislikes both the Antgonist system and mentor matches only wishes to get rid of it by making it possible to opt out of both. Yet they never offer up any solutions to try and fix the current system. Half these problems could be solved with a solid form of communication between players. The prompt system doesnt work. If players (both vet and rookie) could communicate more clearly, coordinating against antags and teaching rookies would be so much easier.
Snip
Only thing that's rough when you begin the game against antags is jack diddly for rewards and wasted time. That's what irked me back when I first started playing and what I feel for newer players today.
That being said, everyone is different. I love the gameplay so much, I didn't mind (most of the time) getting my ass kicked by antags. And it honestly made me a much better player. Not only helps being better against antags obviously, but also the PvE. It really sharpens your awareness and your ability to carry. As for as advantages/disadvantages in PvE, there are ALOT of variables that make that up, player level is just a small part of that. The game not being newbie friendly may not be good on MSE part to the sell the game, but it being a positive or negative is subjective. It's niche title anyway...
As for as folks quitting on sight when an antagonist shows up...don't know if it's a PC/XBox thing, but I play on PS4 and am level 168 and I have only seen that happen like 3 or 4 times through my playtime (and one of them is someone on this forum, who won't be named, but is a level 300+. You should be ashamed of yourself ::)). But your mileage may vary I guess...
I'm not opposed to antags being optional, but that would mean less games for antags. I don't play antag personally, but if I did, that pissed me off. Since I don't, I have no strong feelings, but the PvP folk would have every right to get mad ... My personal opinion is to just penalize players a portion of their rewards who opt out of antag. Tier 5 (LV 1-19) won't get penalized, but after that penalty will be steeper the farther the tier.
For now, like I suggest to every anti-antag person, find a group on reddit, discord, gamefaqs, etc who feel the same as you do and squad up. You'll queue matches much faster and you can all surrender when an antag shows up.
PvP is just a one shot fest idk how anyone can enjoy that but whatever. And I was probably the lv 300 I don't really care about being exposed online tbh so feel free to do so.
Get
Good
<3
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Oy vey. I understand peoples frustrations with the Antagonist system it can be broken at times. But please tell me how is it other players have such a hard time dealing with an Antag and i dont? How is it my games are so different from theirs that they would call for the Antagonist system to be removed or made optional? But before you answer let me give you a little insight on how i play the game.
When i jump on Spacelords I check to see what Bps are available and which ones have very high gold and faction rewards. I play as a raider when try to obtain my daily rewards and when completed ill switch up and play as an Antag for a few games. I run in to my fair share antags. I win some i lose some, but i have a good time. I get that some of the player base doesnt like PVP but its not like they arent skilled players. So what reason could you give me other than "you dont like PVP" to get rid of the Antagonist system.
Further more Every person that dislikes both the Antgonist system and mentor matches only wishes to get rid of it by making it possible to opt out of both. Yet they never offer up any solutions to try and fix the current system. Half these problems could be solved with a solid form of communication between players. The prompt system doesnt work. If players (both vet and rookie) could communicate more clearly, coordinating against antags and teaching rookies would be so much easier.
Snip
Only thing that's rough when you begin the game against antags is jack diddly for rewards and wasted time. That's what irked me back when I first started playing and what I feel for newer players today.
That being said, everyone is different. I love the gameplay so much, I didn't mind (most of the time) getting my ass kicked by antags. And it honestly made me a much better player. Not only helps being better against antags obviously, but also the PvE. It really sharpens your awareness and your ability to carry. As for as advantages/disadvantages in PvE, there are ALOT of variables that make that up, player level is just a small part of that. The game not being newbie friendly may not be good on MSE part to the sell the game, but it being a positive or negative is subjective. It's niche title anyway...
As for as folks quitting on sight when an antagonist shows up...don't know if it's a PC/XBox thing, but I play on PS4 and am level 168 and I have only seen that happen like 3 or 4 times through my playtime (and one of them is someone on this forum, who won't be named, but is a level 300+. You should be ashamed of yourself ::)). But your mileage may vary I guess...
I'm not opposed to antags being optional, but that would mean less games for antags. I don't play antag personally, but if I did, that pissed me off. Since I don't, I have no strong feelings, but the PvP folk would have every right to get mad ... My personal opinion is to just penalize players a portion of their rewards who opt out of antag. Tier 5 (LV 1-19) won't get penalized, but after that penalty will be steeper the farther the tier.
For now, like I suggest to every anti-antag person, find a group on reddit, discord, gamefaqs, etc who feel the same as you do and squad up. You'll queue matches much faster and you can all surrender when an antag shows up.
PvP is just a one shot fest idk how anyone can enjoy that but whatever. And I was probably the lv 300 I don't really care about being exposed online tbh so feel free to do so.
Get
Good
<3
Lol
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Wait, who is asking for antagonists system to be removed? All I've ever heard is to make PvP optional, so it can be a CHOICE for the player playing the game, not removing it. So those raiders who want improved rewards and/or PvP would opt in for PvP and so would have a chance of being invaded, whereas players who opt out would have no chance of being invaded.
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@Tekato: I am not a Veteran. I did not play this game back when it was called "Raiders of the Broken Planet". If i am correct this game has already been out for more than year and has only recently converted and renamed Spacelords. I only started playing this game back in September. That being said I am level 120 and i started at the beginning just like everyone else.
Your proposed fix sounds like it could work. Its basically Crucible in Destiny where levels are eliminated so the playing field is evened out. Then you have Iron Banner where levels count. I'm not against that but I'm not entirely for it. No one wants to max out there weapons for it to be nerfed because its PVP. I want to see that damage, I want to feel good when i shoot my weapon.
When it comes to the Antagonist system, I think its been made clear by MSE they are sticking to their guns and keeping the system the way it is. Its not MSE's fault that PVE players are unhappy with this game. MSE never advertised this game was a PVE title its is a 4 v 1 pvp game. It says it right there on the homepage. They havent tried to sell you on anything else. You are not unhappy with the state of the game, you are unhappy with the game itself. You came into a game where you yourself wasnt the target audience.
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@Tekato: I am not a Veteran. I did not play this game back when it was called "Raiders of the Broken Planet". If i am correct this game has already been out for more than year and has only recently converted and renamed Spacelords. I only started playing this game back in September. That being said I am level 120 and i started at the beginning just like everyone else.
Your proposed fix sounds like it could work. Its basically Crucible in Destiny where levels are eliminated so the playing field is evened out. Then you have Iron Banner where levels count. I'm not against that but I'm not entirely for it. No one wants to max out there weapons for it to be nerfed because its PVP. I want to see that damage, I want to feel good when i shoot my weapon.
When it comes to the Antagonist system, I think its been made clear by MSE they are sticking to their guns and keeping the system the way it is. Its not MSE's fault that PVE players are unhappy with this game. MSE never advertised this game was a PVE title its is a 4 v 1 pvp game. It says it right there on the homepage. They havent tried to sell you on anything else. You are not unhappy with the state of the game, you are unhappy with the game itself. You came into a game where you yourself wasnt the target audience.
Duly noted and dismissed.
People will keep bringing it up regardless. And they should. If for anything for the developers to gauge the player-base, monitor the situation, and make decisions based on the feedback.
If they feel at any point it would be more advantageous to make it optional then they will do so. I cannot see all ends, and neither can any of the other players, so who knows what these circumstances may be. However, me and others like me will continue to keep this on the back burner and let the steam pipe in from time to time to keep the topic relevant. That's because it IS relevant, to a certain non-insignificant portion of the player-base. All we're doing is applying pressure.
Maybe they already have something in the works, maybe it will take another year, who knows. But we keep applying the pressure. We try not to be rude, mean, or toxic (we TRY), sometimes we get tilted over it, but we keep the feedback coming on on optional PvP. Even if it doesn't make them create optional PvP it might cause them to do something else they would not have normally done. But we're not going to be quiet because PvPers want us to, that's for sure.
EDIT: I'd like to think I have calmed down a lot. I won't lie, I still get tilted. But instead of leaving a melt down rant here I go to discord and leave a bit of feedback if I feel it was unfair and/or look at Spacelord memes there for a while and cool down before I play again. Because let's be honest, you don;t get an antag that often. I'd say every 1/7 or so games you get one. And out of those I get I win about 80%. This doesn't mean am ok with them happening, i endure them. but since antagonists is less of an issue now I feel it's unreasonable for me to get as upset as I used to and instead just take a time out. And for those of you who hate PvP like me, you know who you are, I highly recommend trying to manage the tilt more and just keep the pressure here on the forums. I wouldn't bring up the rants again unless we see a giant increase in antagonist and it we get them more than 50% of the time.
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@Drow. I haven't told anyone to be silent because they have different ideas for this game (as far as i can remember). I am trying to sway people to my side. I also haven't shown anyone any disrespect by immediately dismissing what they say.
Tekato doesn't even play this game anymore, but I still listen to what he says. He was part of the player base. If you took my message to Tekato as dismissive, it wasnt. His idea to fix the PVP isn't a bad idea but i am skeptical. Honestly it have to be implemented for me to give and educated opinion on it. As well as point out that he may not be the targeted audience so maybe he could compromise on certain aspects of this game.
I am trying to get people to accept the game for what it is and work together to make the PVP better so that even PVE players could enjoy it. That meaning all players will continue to be part of Antag missions but they are still having fun.
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Fair enough. My apologies if it came off defensive.
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PvP is just a one shot fest idk how anyone can enjoy that but whatever. And I was probably the lv 300 I don't really care about being exposed online tbh so feel free to do so.
Yeah...it can feel like a "one shot fest" at times, but it really does keep you on your toes and makes you approach the game differently. I'm neutral on the antag system really, but the chance of invasion keeps the game from being too stale, I'm okay with it.
And no, it wasn't you. Didn't you say you always offer surrender first? That I don't actually mind, but his guy just outright disconnected SMH...
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Apology accepted. I know text can be dead at times and can be read in numerous ways.
Imagine though if this was physically a room filled with people. Everyone would have their hands around someone else neck. haha
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PvP is just a one shot fest idk how anyone can enjoy that but whatever. And I was probably the lv 300 I don't really care about being exposed online tbh so feel free to do so.
Yeah...it can feel like a "one shot fest" at times, but it really does keep you on your toes and makes you approach the game differently. I'm neutral on the antag system really, but the chance of invasion keeps the game from being too stale, I'm okay with it.
And no, it wasn't you. Didn't you say you always offer surrender first? That I don't actually mind, but his guy just outright disconnected SMH...
Your statement made me think of another reason I have an issue with the antagonists system. That's, do you choose characters anticipating an antag? do you choose characters you enjoy playing? Or do you choose characters best suited for the mission, a lot that are weak against antagonists? Remember, it's not like Overwatch, you can't go back and change you character to counter your opponent. And you also cannot see what the antagonists chooses.
It kind of sucks because you really don't have that total freedom.
As far as the disconnect goes. I won't mind that after the Guild update. This will mean we get a Cortez brother. And the Cortez brother doesn't take away from our life pool. This is actually amazing. Imagine having all 3 other players disconnecting, which has happened to me, and having 3 Cortez brothers against an antagonists. None of the kills on the brothers would matter. i guess for his aleph building it would. But you would be the only Raider that mattered and it would be hard for him to focus you. Especially if you were like Ginebra. You would have infinite spawning Allies.
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You forget one thing Drow.
If you're the only human player and you are running around as Ginebra..who is doing the objective? It isn't the Cortez bros.
In this very specific situation the Antagonist only has to wait and the longer it takes you to do the objective the more the Antagonist wins. Will the Cortez bros. search for the Antagonist? Will they just idle about once they lose a target? We simply don't know.
It also seems highly likely that the Cortez bros. will be scaled down in lethality to whatever the Antagonist's AI is set.
One thing is for sure; the AI will not be as optimal as a human player thinking and strategizing.
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PvP is just a one shot fest idk how anyone can enjoy that but whatever. And I was probably the lv 300 I don't really care about being exposed online tbh so feel free to do so.
Yeah...it can feel like a "one shot fest" at times, but it really does keep you on your toes and makes you approach the game differently. I'm neutral on the antag system really, but the chance of invasion keeps the game from being too stale, I'm okay with it.
And no, it wasn't you. Didn't you say you always offer surrender first? That I don't actually mind, but his guy just outright disconnected SMH...
It doesn't "feel" like it, that's exactly what it is. You can't have a seriously balanced pvp when you have weapons and cards with 100-200%+ damage buffs. Sure you can get better as a raider/antag but at the end of the day if you get hit by a random crit no amount of skill is going to save you. This game has many easy kill methods/exploits and lag/latency issues from peer to peer can make cqc into a complete joke. It's just going to keep getting worst and worst the more weapons and cards we get. Just make this mess optional so those of us that don't care for this game mode won't have to deal with it anymore.
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Hi everyone!
Our intention when we created this new system was being honest with the player. We want to first show him or her the nature of Spacelords. That means cooperate together using all your resources to complete a mission and defeating the Antagonist.
Once the player understands the mechanics, he/she can enjoy the training mode and practice to improve his/her stats. I know we have said this many times, but the core of Spacelords is the Antagonist feature and we would love for all the players to experience it, at least once.
Sorry Karen (and Herman) but no. This is an inaccurate statement to the point of just feeding us a line.
Tuesday night, while I was playing a PVE (no antag) on No Reservations, we got all the way to the end....and then lost because a Level 2 Alicia was sitting on 5 Aleph instead of powering the engine. I can't even get pissed about this because, at level 2, they've probably never played this map. They have no idea what they're doing because Mercurysteam has intentionally locked them out of being able to learn the map before coming online.
If anything, the Star system should be reversed to where the player has to successfully complete the particular map once on training mode before they can play it online. This way, even on Easy mode, they will learn the basics of the map before they come online. The current system does not help anyone learn the mechanics. In fact, it accomplishes the opposite because, as has been mentioned (a few thousand times) on the forums, people would rather suicide than play with someone who has no idea what they're doing.
This isn't enhancing the experience. It's just Mercurysteam cribbing off EA's ill-fated attempts to have an always online experience with their games.
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Imagine having all 3 other players disconnecting, which has happened to me...
(https://i.ibb.co/k89M5G1/Shot00501.png)
(https://pics.ballmemes.com/i-know-that-feel-bro-35509732.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/KD9q4Dg/Shot00505.png)
Meow
(https://i.ibb.co/kQsJV8Q/Screenshot-20180702-080657-Xbox.jpg)
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@Tekato, as far as "one shot fests" go, at certain difficulties even a lowly grunt can drop you with one blast. At your level I know that you know this already. Ungodly amount of damage that can drop your fully overhealed Hive in a heartbeat is a regular occurrence with the way they jack up the adds in this game. CQC has always been a rock paper scissors guessing game to an extent and it just takes feeling out the Antagonist your battling to see what their tendencies are. I'm no god at this game, and I don't use a mic either when I play to coordinate, but I do try and play as much as I can in a team and avoid random matchmaking and that results in wins 95% of the time regardless of whether or not an Antagonist shows up. Sorry for the long post but I guess in closing I'm trying to say that I highly doubt Mercurysteam is going to change the way damage is dealt and the way the crits work and the cqc and everything. One of their main goals is to make this game super challenging so that's how it is whether we like it or not.
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Ugh.
Are you blind, dude?
Literally in the post you quote the reason for the game being the way it is now is explained to you. It is not a line. They are telling you directly why it is this way.
They want people to learn the game in this fashion. So what if a level 2 is hoarding Aleph? Are you not good enough at the game that one person holding on to 5 Aleph is the deciding factor between whether you win or lose?
Have you considered that maybe you lost that match because you're just not good at the game?
Also, the fuck does EA have to do with any of this?
There are many many many online only games made by many many different developers.
This shit is nonsense, bro.
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@Tekato, as far as "one shot fests" go, at certain difficulties even a lowly grunt can drop you with one blast. At your level I know that you know this already. Ungodly amount of damage that can drop your fully overhealed Hive in a heartbeat is a regular occurrence with the way they jack up the adds in this game. CQC has always been a rock paper scissors guessing game to an extent and it just takes feeling out the Antagonist your battling to see what their tendencies are. I'm no god at this game, and I don't use a mic either when I play to coordinate, but I do try and play as much as I can in a team and avoid random matchmaking and that results in wins 95% of the time regardless of whether or not an Antagonist shows up. Sorry for the long post but I guess in closing I'm trying to say that I highly doubt Mercurysteam is going to change the way damage is dealt and the way the crits work and the cqc and everything. One of their main goals is to make this game super challenging so that's how it is whether we like it or not.
I'm fine with the AI one shotting since you can use cover and have ways to deal with them. But players no, they can easily get you behind cover and some characters don't even need to aim. One example is rak with shepherd he can just shoot his grenades at a wall near you, they will bounce and most likely take you out in one blast. And what I meant by the cqc is lag can make your grapples slow down or speed up to the point where someone can sneak up do a grapple and you won't even hear the sound, and there's a lot of cases where you punch someone right infront of you but for some reason it fails. This makes cqc inconsistent and unreliable.
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Oh yes the lag with cqc and missing strikes that should land and then get you grabbed and killed is infuriating. I definitely hear you with that one.
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Hmmm I feel CQC feels less responsive from 3 months ago when i started playing.. Idk if that is my mind playing tricks on me or something was actually changed. Did something change with CQC or is it just my connection?
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(https://phantompilots.com/attachments/screenshot_2015-06-05-21-46-34-png.21191/)
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training mode is good and all, but i would like to also play the game offline too, like i said some people have aren't fortunate to keep a steady internet connection,some people wanna play it alone offline, look at the cut-scenes offline , i love the game, i been with it since beta, i just want the offline mode back, everything else is good, i have no problems with the antagonist because i be wrecking their shit lol
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Ugh.
Are you blind, dude?
Literally in the post you quote the reason for the game being the way it is now is explained to you. It is not a line. They are telling you directly why it is this way.
Which is the same thing EA does when they tell the community "here's why things are the way they are."
They want people to learn the game in this fashion. So what if a level 2 is hoarding Aleph? Are you not good enough at the game that one person holding on to 5 Aleph is the deciding factor between whether you win or lose?
When the engine is running out of Aleph and someone is just sitting on 5 aleph because they don't know what they're supposed to do, that is actually a problem. If the person had gone through the map once or twice on their own, they would know "charge the engine". (People would also not kill elites but that's a common complaint that's been done to death.)
Have you considered that maybe you lost that match because you're just not good at the game?
Deflecting critiques by disparaging my abilities does not actually invalidate my argument.
Also, the fuck does EA have to do with any of this?
There are many many many online only games made by many many different developers.
This shit is nonsense, bro.
Because the Spacelords update did the exact thing that EA used to do back in the days of C & C 4 when they were pushing the "always online" idea.
It was a failure then too.
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Hurk!
Listen man. I have not lost No Reservations..in like forever. I might have never lost it. And I played it a lot, it was one of my go-to missions. I have played it with low levels, I have played it with high levels, with Antagonists, in a box, with a fox, while being pelted with rocks. Played it with 2 disconnects and even once with 3 disconnects.
One person is more than enough to complete the mission.
And this has to do with offline mode and 4 v 4 pvp because..I dunno.
I think it has something to do with people who come to this game and don't want it to be hard so they blah blah about changes that need to be made to fundamental systems that have been a part of the game since its inception.
I know there was some offline before the re-branding. I didn't play back then though and the game seems to work just fine without all that.
So, if you find that I do not respect your opinion because of your game playing abilities then that is because it seems like your opinions are entirely based off your own game play abilities.
MSE hears those un-skilled opinions and changes the game based off those opinions. But, what you think is a problem or bad feature is really just you being a newb. That is not ok. A lot of people come here to bitch about the game well before they have hit level 200. Some do it just after playing for a day and they assume they know everything.
I would wager a lot that you are one of those people.