Mercurysteam's Hangout
BARRACKS => Bug report & Technical Support => Topic started by: Level9Drow on February 16, 2018, 08:24:24 AM
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I think your difficulty score % are overtuned after the most recent update. 31% feels and hits like 50%. Me and my usual team if people I group with are fairly experienced with the missions and found that while losing games at 61% is understandable we kept losing game after game after game, even as the difficulty score went down to "adjust", and out of about 6 or 7 games we only managed to complete 1 or 2. We knew something was wrong when we lost one at 21%. Mind you, before you criticize, I have beaten all missions off line on hard, we have had plenty of successes before the update at 35% - 45%. So while I'm not the most stellar player, I should and have been able to deal with 30% to 35% easily.
Is 20% the new 40%, 30% the new 60%? Was this on purpose to stagger the rewards progression and force more grind? Or is this a bug and are they overtuned? Can we tune them back to normal please? It isn't any fun to lose several games in a row with very little to show for your actual real life time. This was a very unhappy night, VERY unsatisfying, NO feeling of accomplishment or even entertainment.
Thanks!
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My Squad and I noticed the same at 76%+ .
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My Squad and I noticed the same at 76%+ .
Yikes! 76%?? Omg, I would not want to experience that, even in the old version. I thought I hated 60%.
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Lots of reports about this in Discord as well. I have only played a couple of antag games since Doldren Day, but should get some co-op in tonight.
The difficulty was fine before patch 07, seems to only be getting harder just because some players have hit the 100% cap... can't punish everybody because 4 people play exclusively together :(
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Lots of reports about this in Discord as well. I have only played a couple of antag games since Doldren Day, but should get some co-op in tonight.
The difficulty was fine before patch 07, seems to only be getting harder just because some players have hit the 100% cap... can't punish everybody because 4 people play exclusively together :(
I understand, I realize that after so many successes you are going to start getting your but kicked as the ELO adjust to your success. And I've now accepted this and just take my lumps, but also understand that it's ok, becuase getting your but kicked enough makes the system adjust the other way. But this wasn't happening, LOL. I know the finish screen "says 35%" but it didn't feel like it went down at all. We kept getting our buts kicked. Ironically the only time it got easy was when we fought an antagonist, LOL. Imagine me saying that out of all people, Level9Drow relieved to see an antag.
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Some suspect the scaling on PC and console was not the same Drow. I have no proof either way but I did find it a bit odd how much higher PC was than console... even some of the best console players who were extremely good. I mean we're talking a 40% gap... that's not likely or realistic for PC to be that far ahead but you know... raisins.
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Hi guys,
Some missions have experienced an adjustement in the last update in order to balance them, so they can still imply a challenge for the players.
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It still seems to be present. I've noticed that the loss %, for me at least, is very high this last week. The AI mooks shouldn't rapid chain melee, especially at 35% - 45%, there's quite literally NOTHING at all you can do about it when wounded, can't shoot, dodge, nothing. Challenge is one thing, but being powerless if shot once or twice is not fun at all.
I still feel it's overtuned. I figured if the ELO system sensed enough losses it would decrease, NOPE, it's not, it DOESN'T go down, at least not at a rate that is significant or noticeable enough. The difficulty is outweighing the fun factor. You have to have a balance for some suspension of disbelief. Are these Raiders, these heroes, you're playing really awesome and competent characters? Are they unique with unique powers? If they are should common mooks kill them so easily? If so, then what makes the heroes so special? Elites are one thing, but mooks should be able to solo you, unless the difficulty is high (NOTE: What's laughable is the elites can be EASIER than the mooks at higher difficulties because they follow the rules of CQC, the mooks DON'T).
Example: You go to melee the mook, the roll, fine, then kick, kick, your down, then fire weapon, your dead. Really? on 35% -45%? It's even worse with shot guns, you keep getting staggered and are effectively CCed into lack of any movement until dead.
Is this a ploy to lengthen grind? If it is, it's not any fun. I now ONLY have fun at around 30% which is the fairest difficulty in terms of being a hero fighting weaker, but dangerous, minions with dangerous elites.
Please either tune the difficulty down OR, if not that, make the ELO a little more intelligent and drop the difficulty a little further after a lost game. Losing over and over and over again when you have absolutely NO control over the games difficulty is REALLY unfun. I'd like to add that if we could choose the difficulty we wanted none of this would be an issue in the first place.
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agreed that it seems silly that regular enemies play by different rules than everyone else. I've been hit by their melee attacks even after striking them without them rolling inbetween. Their melee is always top priority, and they can chain it together endlessly if they feel like it. I got stomped by a hollow one on In Shock last night when he dropped down near me in the corner then just used 4 melee attacks in a row with no way to escape.
Also why do they get to run while shooting and we can't? Enemies run all over the place at full sprint, shooting any direction they want, with perfect accuracy. Drow is right, elites are strong and deadly because they can grab, but at least they play by the same rules as the raiders.
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Right, and none of this is wrong, if it's on a difficulty of like 50% -60%. I mean then, yea, the mooks are DEADLY, and probably should be. But even if the developers are saying that the difficulties are as they should, well then could my ELO actually work and can the difficulty actually go back down?
After losing over and over I was noticing there was very little to no change in the difficulty on the end game screen. I thought o myself, "Shouldn't it be getting easier now?" It stayed at about 45% -48% (a few times it was 50%-ish, which was INSANE) for 5 or 6 games, ALL LOSSES, and did not change at all. I was getting pissed.
I don't mind sucking or being mediocre while other people are really good, that's why ELO exist in modern games in the first place. I figure the ELO will take care of me. I think after 5 losses or so it finally went down to about 35%-ish.
It feels to me that the ELO makes the % go up fast but go down slow. It should be the same rate both ways. I am fearful that this may be a gating mechanism function created to enhance the grind. I hope not.
EDIT: I'm going to make a post of solutions on this under Suggestions
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Hola,
I believe that the difficulty is right.4 good Riders at level 40/50 can safely finish the missions always.
The "impossible" difficulty in my opinion comes when the 4 riders were not chosen correctly.
Each mission has "OBLIGED" Riders (like Kostantin in the level save the protector).
This naturally at high levels.
With an antagonist (with the right riders) the level is lowered according to me.
Then if the antagonist is a good good then the speech changes ...
PS: sorry for the Italian translator language
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I completely agree. "Mooks" haha. The double stomp/shotgun blast combo or the unlimited machine gun at point blank is crazy. Add in AI that can kill you with random spray from across the map with ridiculous accuracy is annoying. I understand at higher ELO they have to make it more difficult, but we are talking Mooks(still laughing).
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40/50 is one thing, but 60 gets crazy real fast and I'm sure console is a little behind PC about what is playable, but still. I know the team we play with are among the best players, because I've played with virtually everyone who is still playing
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40/50 is one thing, but 60 gets crazy real fast and I'm sure console is a little behind PC about what is playable, but still. I know the team we play with are among the best players, because I've played with virtually everyone who is still playing
I'm just asking for my ELO placement and adjustment to work. I don't care WHAT difficulty the game is at, I should end up where I'm supposed to be. And if I'm losing over and over, I'm CLEARLY not where I'm supposed to be and this is a failure of the placement system.
Aslo, the mooks are ridiculous.
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I dunno, you seemed pretty fine when we played Weapon From The Past together. IT was that damn Lv0 Lycus just doing his own thing that was a liability lol. Playing with randoms, your ability to handle high difficulties WILL suffer. Playing with the same team will improve your chances of going higher.
But yeah 60% is pretty much the breaking point for me, I've won at that high but hardly, if ever, win above that point. If the best players on a platform can't even reach 90-100% (or even in the 70's!) then what's the point of the difficulty/reward system at all? :\
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Well to be fair, Alicia, especially with the new Novera, is especially effective against mooks. If you noticed ALL I was doing was staying in the air as much as possible, removing the possibility for melee attacks. I did not want to touch the ground at all. And even then, the Hollow One shot guns would constantly stun and ground me, I would have to jump again when they reloaded. I also have the rare card for regen 100 after 3 seconds with her, so I would heal while escaping very fast.
I grouped with you after all the losses at 45% - 50% getting dominated by mooks and chose her out of exasperation, lol. That was my first win for the day. I consider that the exception, not the rule. :)
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Unfortunately, I am not sure how much of the changes I am seeing since I tend to play with newer players enough that it grounds the difficulty. Since the changes, I am not sure even PC players are hitting those higher percentages like they used to. I see two reasons why they might have pulled ahead. First, they simply are running better hardware and that can 'smooth' out the gameplay in subtle but important ways. Second, those really high percentage players tended to be dedicated group players and I do mean for very long periods of time so even after the increase they still remained quite high.
To me, it seems most people will cap around 50 and that's basically the equivalent to Hard difficulty if you solo. Realistically, most will start dying a lot just in the 30's. Ultimately, it boils down to if you want to win often or have a sufficient challenge for your skill level. If you want to win more often, grouping with extremely skilled players can actually work against you unless you can pull just as much weight as they can. Conversely, you might find yourself getting bored after a while because honestly at lower difficulties the game can be quite breezy.
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I'm fine with breezy. I have fun, kick ass as a hero, relax and earn rewards. As an older gamer I'm not enamored by "epeen" and am used to games that are more about fun then being high strung. Just because something is stressful and intense doesn't mean it's fun as well.
You know you mentioned a good core group. I often group with a few people who are fairly decent. We start getting many successes in a row and in the back of my head I think, "Wel crap, I know the ELO system is going to make me pay for this later. I'm going to regret all these wins." And I do, I hit 45% - 50% either with them or alone, then everyone gets jaded and upset, people at that point after hitting the "plateau" are more inclined to "call it a night" and leave group. And then as individuals, we're stuck for the next day on a losing streak.
It's strange, isn't it. It's more like paying a toll after winning so much. You know you will be punished after the wins and there isn't anything you can do about it. So then you log in just to take your lumps for your wins and there isn't any way around it. A very bi-polar system. At that point I just want to hurry up and lose to get back to the fun difficulty. It promotes jaded and apathetic effort at that point.
I can't stress this enough; you need to be able to control your own difficulty. Reduce the rewards for lower difficulties, I'm fine with that, it's fair. I'd rather slowly grind in comfort than rapidly leap ahead in constant aggravation. At the end of the day, what value does the rewards have if you aren't even having fun playing the game? This is why i left Overwatch. After the allure of the loot boxes, I left because all there is in that game is PvP, toxicity and tilting. I didn't care if I won the rarest skin from a loot box if I had to keep doing THAT every day.
BUT!!!! Q, I want to thank you for you awesome insight though. You are a very dedicated player with a very great attitude, much more than this cynic here. You are a delight to run with in game and don't let my opinion change your attitude. This is just my tastes, that's all. I express my feeling sbecause I love this game.